wu :: forums
        (http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~wwu/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi)
      

        general >> psychology >> Elevator experiment
        
(Message started by: BenVitale on Oct 21st, 2009, 11:59am)
Title: Elevator experiment
Post by BenVitale on Oct 21st, 2009, 11:59am
Some of us conform easily, others find it necessary to question every existing convention.

Key concept : Conformity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conformity)


View the Elevator psychology experiment (http://www.boreme.com/boreme/funny-2008/elevator-psychology-experiment-p1.php)

How would you react in the same situation?

Have you tried any experiment in an elevator?

For example: Dropping a book (or any other thing, say money) in the elevator to see who helps you pick it up with one person in elevator as opposed to with 4,5, 6 or more people in the elevator.

if riding alone in an elevator, where are you most likely to stand?
(1) against the back wall close to the center,
(2) facing the front, up against the door,
(3) to the left front, or
(4) to the right front.

Do you stand still and stare at the ceiling, the floor or the button panel as if you’ve never seen it before?

Elevators are relatively recent inventions, but the social challenges they pose are nothing new. Close proximity to other people in restricted spaces is not new, it has occurred many many times in the history of mankind, in our evolutionary history.


How about when joining other riders?

Do you stop talking as soon as the doors close?
Why don't people stand away from an opening door, thus allowing people inside the elevator to exit first?
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by JiNbOtAk on Oct 28th, 2009, 4:34am
Since I work in the tallest building Penang (something T&B could verify) I think this is an interesting topic for discussion.


on 10/21/09 at 11:59:56, BenVitale wrote:
How would you react in the same situation?


I'd probably ask the person next to me what he/she is staring at.


on 10/21/09 at 11:59:56, BenVitale wrote:
Have you tried any experiment in an elevator?


Nope, but then most of the time I'm in the elevator, it's packed to the max.


on 10/21/09 at 11:59:56, BenVitale wrote:
if riding alone in an elevator, where are you most likely to stand?
(1) against the back wall close to the center,
(2) facing the front, up against the door,
(3) to the left front, or
(4) to the right front.


None of the above, I usually stand against the left/right wall, facing centre. Never thought about it much before this..


on 10/21/09 at 11:59:56, BenVitale wrote:
Do you stand still and stare at the ceiling, the floor or the button panel as if you’ve never seen it before?


Most of us (those whom I share my elevator ride with) tend to focus on the display panel showing the level. I believe that's because we don't want to miss our level, which could be tiresome.


on 10/21/09 at 11:59:56, BenVitale wrote:
How about when joining other riders?

Do you stop talking as soon as the doors close


Depends, on how full the elevator is. Most of the time, I tend to keep quiet, and pick off the conversation after exiting the elevator. I think (but I don't know for sure) that's what most people do.


on 10/21/09 at 11:59:56, BenVitale wrote:
Why don't people stand away from an opening door, thus allowing people inside the elevator to exit first?


When you say people, do you mean people about to enter the elevator, or those who are already in the elevator ?
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by BenVitale on Oct 28th, 2009, 3:10pm

on 10/28/09 at 04:34:58, JiNbOtAk wrote:
Since I work in the tallest building Penang (something T&B could verify)

Is the 13th floor in your buiding given the number 14 or something else?

Read more.... Thirteenth floor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_floor)


Quote:
I think this is an interesting topic for discussion.

I think so too.




Quote:
When you say people, do you mean people about to enter the elevator, or those who are already in the elevator ?


I meant, people who charge into elevators, head down, without waiting to see if anyone is getting
off. The same thing happens with buses, subway cars, trains, etc. Especially during rush hours.
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by Vondell on Oct 28th, 2009, 3:52pm
Gotta love Candid Camera.
Interesting experiment in conformity.
In the same situation, I'd like to think I'd face forward (toward the doors...especially if I've ridden in the elevator before).  And, I'd definitely keep my hat on.   :)
I tend to stand in one of 2 places when alone in an elevator.  Either at the rear center, or rear right corner (as you face the front).  No real reason for this, just something I do.  I generally look around the whole elevator to see what's in it...security camera, call box, that sort of thing.  If it happens to be a glass elevator, then I'll turn around and look outside for a perspective I don't normally get to see.
As for conversation...I normally don't give more than a "How's it going?" or equivalent.
As far as people standing in front of the door, I'm sorry to say that it seems as if common courtesy is going the way of the dodo.  This has turned into a "me first" society.  I work in retail, so I see this quite a bit, unfortunately.  The phrase "thank you" is continually thrown to the wayside.  When was the last time someone in front of you held the door open for you?  Or you for them?  Stop so someone could pull out on a busy road?  Chances are you probably don't see too much of this behavior anymore.  I'f I'm wrong, I'd love to hear about it.   :)
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by towr on Oct 29th, 2009, 1:56am

on 10/28/09 at 15:52:59, Vondell wrote:
When was the last time someone in front of you held the door open for you? Or you for them?
Happens quite a lot at the apartment building I live. If there is an opportunity not to slam the front door in someone's face, most people will take it. And if someone's carrying stuff, I'll even open the door for them and let them through first. Besides, it's faster than waiting for them to fiddle with their keys and open the door.
The downside is when there is just a tad too much distance between yourself and the person holding the door open for you, because then you feel you need to rush (moreso when you actually wanted to check your mailbox first, but feel obliged to go for the door because they hold it open for you).
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by Grimbal on Oct 29th, 2009, 2:24am

on 10/28/09 at 15:10:13, BenVitale wrote:
Is the 13th floor in your buiding given the number 14 or something else?

I think that for Chinese, 14 is a more unlucky number than 13.
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by BenVitale on Oct 29th, 2009, 2:46am

on 10/29/09 at 02:24:01, Grimbal wrote:
I think that for Chinese, 14 is a more unlucky number than 13.


Even in the U.S. because I haven't noticed 13 in many buidings. Hotels do not have it, they do it in order to cater to their superstitious customers.

-----------------------------
Economists have frequently observed that individuals tend to conform in their behavior to the behavior of similar individuals.

A tough question economists ask:

Is it rational?

They wonder whether the outcome of such behavior can be consistent with self-interest.

Let me explain what economists mean by "rational."

Rational behavior is, and I quote:

"In developing the logic of choice, economists assume that people are rational, which means that people have well-defined goals and that they purposefully and logically act to attain those goals as best they can, given their circumstances. You might note that economics does not judge the goals themselves as rational or irrational. Economists almost always take goals as given. People are irrational if, given their goals, they act in ways that do not lead to the accomplishment of their goals."
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by Vondell on Oct 29th, 2009, 10:48am

on 10/29/09 at 01:56:38, towr wrote:
Happens quite a lot at the apartment building I live. If there is an opportunity not to slam the front door in someone's face, most people will take it.



This is good to hear/read.  I don't see too much of this behavior where I'm at.  Do you see the same to hold true outside of your apartment complex where the people are less likely to know each other?

Also, isn't it the same that many airlines do not have a 13th aisle?

If one does not conform, is he/she a rebel?  Or simply an individual?
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by towr on Oct 29th, 2009, 12:20pm

on 10/29/09 at 10:48:36, Vondell wrote:
This is good to hear/read.  I don't see too much of this behavior where I'm at.  Do you see the same to hold true outside of your apartment complex where the people are less likely to know each other?
Aside from my apartments building and university the only other places I come tend to have doors that open by themselves. However, another thing is that at the supermarket I have regularly been offered to cut in line when I only had one or two items.
On the other hand, my neighbours don't tend to be too considerate when playing their music; and the same goes for travelers on the train with their hearing-damaging MP3-players. It probably just doesn't cross their mind that it's annoying.
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by BenVitale on Oct 31st, 2009, 11:43am

on 10/29/09 at 10:48:36, Vondell wrote:
Also, isn't it the same that many airlines do not have a 13th aisle?


Yep, the irrational fear of the number 13


Quote:
If one does not conform, is he/she a rebel?  Or simply an individual?


On the subject of conformity, Emile Henry Gauvreau said:

"I was part of that strange race of people aptly described as spending their lives doing things they detest to make money they don't want to buy things they don't need to impress people they dislike."

----------------------------------------------------

We have two tendencies: the urge to express our individuality and the urge to conform or to fit in.

We humans aren't the only ones who want to fit in. Researchers have discovered that chimpanzees, too, preferentially adopt their fellow chimps' way of doing things.

chimpanzees copy other chimps of the same group

Read more : Chimps Found to Conform to Cultural Norms (http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=chimps-found-to-conform-t)

New research reveals the brain activity that underlies our tendency to "follow the crowd" provides intriguing insight into how human behavior can be guided by the perceived behavior of other individuals.

Read more at: http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/135600.php


I'm gonna check in my book to see what economic theory has to say about this

--- To be continued ---
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by towr on Oct 31st, 2009, 3:35pm
The "economics" of conformity is that you'll get a "best practice" result for minimal effort in deliberation and information gathering.
This is especially so when the behaviour you're conforming to has been selected for by natural selection. Everyone that would have jumped off a cliff, and everyone that would follow them in doing so, have already done so, and therefore the behaviour you're conforming to is practically guaranteed to be conducive to survival.

"When in doubt, follow the crowd."
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by BenVitale on Nov 1st, 2009, 11:25am

on 10/31/09 at 15:35:20, towr wrote:
The "economics" of conformity is that you'll get a "best practice" result for minimal effort in deliberation and information gathering.
This is especially so when the behaviour you're conforming to has been selected for by natural selection. Everyone that would have jumped off a cliff, and everyone that would follow them in doing so, have already done so, and therefore the behaviour you're conforming to is practically guaranteed to be conducive to survival.

"When in doubt, follow the crowd."


You're right.

Game theory has been used to explain conventions.

My book says:
Conventions may evolve spontaneously, that is without human design, in a state of nature ... If no rule is imposed from without, a convention may spontaneously arise.

Can you give an example?

Take the example of 'opening the door'

Wouldn't you say that it is the solution to a coordination problem, a system of mutual expectation about agents'actions, preferences, and rationality.

There are people who will not open the door. They defect
There are people who will open the door. They conform

We have a multi-party Prisoners'dilemma model
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by towr on Nov 1st, 2009, 1:26pm

on 11/01/09 at 11:25:13, BenVitale wrote:
My book says:
Conventions may evolve spontaneously, that is without human design, in a state of nature ... If no rule is imposed from without, a convention may spontaneously arise.

Can you give an example?
A quite famous example is the christmas armistice in world war one. The article also names some similar occasions: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_truce


Quote:
Take the example of 'opening the door'

Wouldn't you say that it is the solution to a coordination problem
No. Opening a door for someone is something entirely up to the person placed to hold open the door, no coordination between the two players is needed. It is not a coordination problem.


Quote:
a system of mutual expectation about agents'actions, preferences, and rationality.
I can't say I really see it. I especially don't see how rationality would come into it anywhere.


Quote:
We have a multi-party Prisoners'dilemma model
In what way? What is, for instance, the sucker's payoff in this case? Holding open a door for someone is practically a non-effort; it's not a risk such as cooperation is in PD.
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by JiNbOtAk on Nov 8th, 2009, 11:57pm

on 10/28/09 at 15:10:13, BenVitale wrote:
Is the 13th floor in your buiding given the number 14 or something else?


Nope, we Malaysians (generally) don't believe in superstitious numbers. Of course, you might find a private building which doesn't have one, but that is more the individual's choice.


on 10/28/09 at 15:52:59, Vondell wrote:
When was the last time someone in front of you held the door open for you?  Or you for them?  Stop so someone could pull out on a busy road?


Quite often, actually. Most of the time cos it's more convenient to do so, rather than being courteous. And women do it for men as well, no gender bias there.  :P
Title: Re: Elevator experiment
Post by Annn on Jun 5th, 2010, 1:17pm
Yeah, it doesn't matter whether men of women :)


Powered by YaBB 1 Gold - SP 1.4!
Forum software copyright © 2000-2004 Yet another Bulletin Board