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Topic: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure (Read 23257 times) |
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PermanentInk
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #25 on: May 27th, 2004, 2:20am » |
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on Aug 2nd, 2002, 11:33pm, Luni_B wrote:| Furthermore, Pythons can not lunge |
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Really? How exactly do you think they grab their prey? I've owned a pair of pythons, and I can assure you they lunge quite efficiently.
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towr
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #26 on: May 27th, 2004, 4:15am » |
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That depends on their temperature of course..
So it'd depend on where the chest were unearthed (if it's in a desert the python would probably be quite energetic if it were still alive)
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PermanentInk
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #27 on: May 27th, 2004, 9:07pm » |
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Okay, I'll grant you that it's incorrect to state that it's not the case that pythons "can not lunge," since the usual meaning of "can not" (as opposed to "cannot") is "can elect not to," but I really think that Luni meant "cannot" in any case.
I wasn't claiming that pythons will lunge in all circumstances, just that they are capable of the act.
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Jarr
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #28 on: Apr 5th, 2005, 12:20pm » |
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the riddle does not ask you to determine which chest has what,
"Based on these inscriptions, which chest should you open?" it says.
the word should is generaly useless when logical, but here it is boxed up good.
more likely some one is sneaking up behind you with a well trained python to perpetuate the myth,
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lee
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #29 on: Apr 30th, 2005, 8:44pm » |
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1: how does a python live in a treasure chest for so long?
2: what kind of idiot cant find a way to know if there is a freakish pyton in a box e.g listening for sounds
3:both could have a python and treasure inside/there are 2 pythons.
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Ricky
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #30 on: May 17th, 2005, 6:31pm » |
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on Jul 27th, 2002, 2:52am, william wu wrote:
Or rather, just take hai-yu-ken's approach, and pay an expendable person to do it for you. I think that's the smartest thing you can do. 
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If you can have unnamed people then you could also have unnamed equipment. Thus, you could rapidly heat one or both chests and use infrared vision to look into it. If the python rapidly changes temperature with it then ther will be no temperature difference throughout the chest. However if it does not then you will see it. Either way you know which has the python.
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SteelSoul
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #31 on: Jun 11th, 2005, 1:06pm » |
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It is so ridiculous how in every single riddle people ignore it COMPLETELY by asking irrelevant questions and solutions from data they invent as they go.
The answer is simple: open the silver box
Explanation:
If the writing on the gold is right then that is the true writing and the silver one is false, so lets open the silver.
If the writing on the gold is false then both inscriptions can't by true (because gold is false) and can't be one true and one false (because then the writing on the gold is true) so it must be both false which means still open silver which is false.
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rmsgrey
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #32 on: Jun 11th, 2005, 1:12pm » |
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on Jun 11th, 2005, 1:06pm, SteelSoul wrote:It is so ridiculous how in every single riddle people ignore it COMPLETELY by asking irrelevant questions and solutions from data they invent as they go.
The answer is simple: open the silver box
Explanation:
If the writing on the gold is right then that is the true writing and the silver one is false, so lets open the silver.
If the writing on the gold is false then both inscriptions can't by true (because gold is false) and can't be one true and one false (because then the writing on the gold is true) so it must be both false which means still open silver which is false. |
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So what happens when the guy setting up the treasure is a complete *child of irregular parentage* and puts the python in the silver chest, and the treasure in the gold chest?
If you trouble to read the first half-page of posts to this thread, you'll notice your solution already given (probably several times, but it's been a while since I last read it myself). Having solved the riddle, we then have a choice: ignore it forever, or try and break it in some way. Those who choose to ignore it tend not to contribute much to the subsequent discussion...
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Icarus
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #33 on: Jun 12th, 2005, 8:31pm » |
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You are going to require more to be steel than your soul. You have made two assumptions unjustified by the information given with the problem:
1) That the inscription on the gold chest means exactlyone of the inscriptions is true.
2) That the inscription on the gold chest has to be either true or false.
In fact, if we go with assumption (1), then assumption (2) is false! If the inscription on the gold chest means that exactly one inscription is true, then the gold inscription is either a contradiction (assuming the statement to be false implies that it is true, and vice versa), or else it is undecidable (both assuming it to be true and assuming it to be false cause no contradictions). Contradictions and undecidable statements are neither true nor false.
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blah blah
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #34 on: Dec 29th, 2005, 5:13pm » |
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 ok look at the silver box. it says"theres a python in it." ok if that silver box said it why would want you to know that there is a python in it? why would they protect you from dying if they knew you were going to take the treasure. so its vice-versa which means the python in the silver box is not really there. they wrote that on it to protect the treasure so that is the answer. soo.. the golden box of course does have the python in it. isn't it obvious?
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rmsgrey
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #35 on: Dec 30th, 2005, 2:11pm » |
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on Dec 29th, 2005, 5:13pm, blah blah wrote:| ok look at the silver box. it says"theres a python in it." ok if that silver box said it why would want you to know that there is a python in it? why would they protect you from dying if they knew you were going to take the treasure. so its vice-versa which means the python in the silver box is not really there. they wrote that on it to protect the treasure so that is the answer. soo.. the golden box of course does have the python in it. isn't it obvious? |
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Except if they figured you'd think that, and they wanted to catch you out, so, knowing that you'd figure the python to be in the Gold box, they put it in the Silver instead...
Of course, they could have figured out that you'd be smart enough to figure that out, so put it in the Gold instead, etc...
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Iulia
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #36 on: Jan 1st, 2006, 12:59am » |
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I think that you should open the silver chest if you want to find the treasure because the gold chest inscripton states that one of the 2 inscriptions are true. If this inscription were not true then the other inscription on the silver chest , which states that the python is in the silver chest would not be true either. So that way you would open the silver chest to find the answer.
If the inscription on the gold chest was ftrue then the other one would have to be wrong because this inscription state that 1 of the 2 inscriptions are right. so the python would again not be in the silver chest and you would find the treasure in it .
So there you can't go wrong anyway . . . unless the legent was not true.
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Icarus
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #37 on: Jan 1st, 2006, 9:21pm » |
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You are assuming that the Gold inscription is either true or false. But it also could be a contradiction (having to be true or false at the same time) or else it could be undecidable (its truth value does not depend on anything given).
To understand this, instead of trying to figure it out from a "what if it is true, what if it is false" approach, consider the problem instead from the two cases allowed by the legend.
According to the legend, one of the two cases contains the python.
Case 1: The python is in the gold chest.
The silver inscription is false.
The gold inscription is undecidable (neither assuming it to be true or assuming it to be false leads to a contradiction).
Case 2: The python is in the silver chest.
The silver inscription is true.
The gold inscription is self-contradicting (both assuming it to be true and assuming it to be false lead to contradictions).
In both cases, the legend is true, but there is no particular reason for you to pick one case over the other, as the legend in no way rules out either undecidable or contradictory inscriptions.
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sov
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #38 on: Nov 3rd, 2006, 10:57am » |
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If the gold inscription is true, then the silver is false (thus the treasure is in the silver). But, if the gold is false, the silver could be true or false. Thus, opening the silver chest gives you a 75% chance of finding the treasure, but still a 25% chance of getting eaten.
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Whiskey Tango Foxtrot
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #39 on: Nov 3rd, 2006, 12:48pm » |
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50-50, my friend. Equal possibility so you might as well guess.
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Icarus
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #40 on: Nov 3rd, 2006, 3:53pm » |
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Indeed - if you read my post immediately above yours, sov, I explained in it the falacy to your approach.
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mrbahl
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #41 on: Aug 7th, 2008, 3:15am » |
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I put the chests there. And there is not treasure.... and yeah there is no python also..
gotcha
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ozzz169
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #42 on: Feb 9th, 2009, 9:50am » |
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OK my 2 cents on this:
"One of these two inscriptions is true."
does not say anything about the other. so one is true, the other is either true or false. so both being true does not invalidate this statement. so the only thing we know is the 2 false case is not possible.
so you still have the tt ft and tf case. and that is not enough information to safely open either case.
all this is assuming that the mythical snake is immortal and that the legend is true.
if not then you still cant open either case because based on intent of the creators of the chest were to protect there gold from non members and could have put an anceint indian jones style booby trap that will shoot 1000 poison darts in all directions in the wrong chest and will kill us all. (if you hide be behind a rock then they have a back up of a very slow acting contagious disease and will still die.
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Grimbal
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Re: LOGICAL SIGNS I - python and treasure
« Reply #43 on: Feb 10th, 2009, 12:38am » |
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Both inscriptions could be false. In that case, it is false that one inscriptions is true.
However, the case TF is not possible logical. The second inscription is true but supposed to be false.
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| « Last Edit: Feb 10th, 2009, 12:39am by Grimbal » |
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