I'll work on it some more tomorrow at work. "government does more harm than good" - you're right, this isn't totally agreed upon. I don't want to try to do complicated moral arguments, since all I want is something so that people will get an idea of what libertarianism is, and where to get more information. How about "the costs of government far outway the benefits, in terms of lost freedom and economic harm"? The "drastically less government" works too. I'll have to take a look at that section. More issues - yes, more issues are a good idea. I can't think of anything to say about religious freedom, though. I hate the right on this issue, don't know the left's position, and since I totally dispise churches, it'd probably be better if someone else wrote that part. "shoot you if you smoke pot" - yeah, stupid phrasing. I still haven't thought of a good way to explain the idea that I personally don't have the right to do what government does, therefore government doesn't either. I'd like a good visual example. Maybe I'll think of something. More books - Bergland and Browne are the most common recommendations for "I know nothing about Libertarianism, and I want to know about it." If there's a book that more closely matches the moral rather than economic arguments against government thatpeople in the club seem to like better, I'l love to hear of it. BLU - how about "There is a more discussion oriented group, the Berkeley Libertarian Union (BLU), that can be reached through Jennie dal Busco, minerva@uclink4"? Or, I'll just ask Jennie for a short description of the group (since I've only been to two meetings) -- kevin@cafe.berkeley.edu Home: (510)665-9670 http://bmw.autobahn.org/~peterson Page: (510)726-8960