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Topic: Here is the purpose of human life - (Read 9813 times) |
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teao
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #50 on: Nov 9th, 2014, 7:17am » |
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on Nov 5th, 2014, 6:14am, rmsgrey wrote:
I can't explain it *******skip******** reasonably convincing story for how the whole thing developed. |
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is this dry talking is your rational explanation ? is this dry nonsense is your rational or logical explanation ?
and i have to believe such an [censored] like you ? just see the fun of your fools paradise.
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| « Last Edit: Dec 6th, 2014, 2:15pm by Grimbal » |
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rloginunix
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #51 on: Nov 9th, 2014, 12:31pm » |
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1). teao, you are engaging in a dubious practice of obscuring the author's content. Mathematics tells us that any large enough body of text can be rearranged in a multitude of ways none of which is author's original intent.
rmsgrey did not say "I can't explain it", he said "I can't explain it in one post, or even in a hundred posts". And that is putting it modestly.
To summarize the entire body of mathematics and physics related knowledge, to answer your "question", a thousand posts is not enough - the modern calculus books are about 1000 pages long if not more, the Quantum Mechanics book that I still have from my college days is 765 pages (Landau/Lifsh*tz), the "Introduction to Complex Analysis" is 571 pages (Shabat), "Optics" is 739 pages (Sivuhin), my 3 tomes of Donald Knuth's "The Art of Computer Programming" totals 2293 pages, "The Course of Theory of Probability" is 389 pages (Gnedenko), "Celestial Mechanics" is 795 pages (Duboshin). This is not even scratching the surface. Geometry, number theory, combinatorial analysis, linear algebra, game theory, group theory, graph theory. "The Princeton Companion to Mathematics" - just an overview of mostly pure math is 1056 pages. I mean it's not even funny ...
2). But that is besides the point - you did not really pose a proper question. This forum's regulars know very well that when you can not frame a proper question but post something anyway it is a sure sign that you yourself do not really understand the topic.
3). on Nov 9th, 2014, 7:17am, teao wrote:| is this dry talking is your rational explanation ? is this dry nonsense is your rational or logical explanation ? |
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To me it is. Yes, it is logical. Yes, it is rational. And no, it is not dry. And no, it is not nonsense. Just saying that something is nonsense does not really make that something nonsense. You need to provide a proof of your statement within the established rules.
4). No one here is asking you to "believe" in anything. At first the German scientist Johannes Kepler "believed" he could explain the inner workings of the Universe with five Platonic Solids. However, later he worked closely with the wealthy Danish astronomer Tycho Brahe who initially kept most of the numbers he obtained to himself. Eventually likely one of the best observational data collectors of his time Brahe realized that Kepler is a much stronger theoretician (likely one of the best of his time) and gave Kepler a full access to the empirical data. A wise decision.
What happened next is very important. Based on solid facts (data), hard logic (numbers simply did not fit) and a chain of reasoning Kepler eventually realized that the planets' orbits are ellipses, not circles, and - pause to ponder - he was a man enough to acknowledge the error of his ways, abandon his earlier beliefs (oh how incredibly hard it must have been!) and stick with ... solid facts, hard logic and reasoning.
This resulted, for example, in the discovery that a planet's radius vector sweeps the sectors of equal square area in equal time periods. Whether you (or I or we) believe that this is true or not is irrelevant - this law is deduced mathematically. If you think that it is not true - please provide a mathematical proof.
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towr
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #52 on: Nov 9th, 2014, 1:23pm » |
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[sarcasm]
Ah, but see, only fools need proof. The wise man simply beliefs whatever he hears from the first person that calls themselves an authority and then closes his mind so pesky doubt can't creep in. And as a special bonus he gets to call other people fools; oh joy!
[/sarcasm]
Anyway, who wants to believe boring things? Who cares if it's true or not, or well-argumented or not. Add a few gods and spirits, throw in some heroes and villains, some love interests and illicit affairs. Soap-opera it up. That's the way to reach the discerning masses.
[/psych! sarcasm actually ends here]
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| « Last Edit: Nov 9th, 2014, 1:26pm by towr » |
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teao
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #53 on: Nov 9th, 2014, 6:03pm » |
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on Nov 9th, 2014, 1:23pm, towr wrote:[sarcasm]
Ah, but see, ****skip****masses.
[/psych! sarcasm actually ends here] |
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the scientific method means first observation, then hypothesis, and then demonstration. But you cannot demonstrate your hypothesis. you simply observe and then speak nonsense.
________
and “Your claim also is myth. Who believes you? If you don’t believe me, I don’t believe you. Finished.”
______
You have got your personal " whims "I’ve got my authority. What is your age? You are all scientists within two hundred years. And our Bhagavata is written five thousand years ago. Why shall I accept yours? You have become all scientists, and everything within two hundred years. What is the age of your European, Western civilization? It cannot go more than three thousand years? Our Bhagavata is written five thousand years ago. And before that, Sukadeva Goswami says, ‘I have heard like this.’ That’s all. Millions and millions of years ago.
and that is all.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 9th, 2014, 6:05pm by teao » |
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towr
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #54 on: Nov 9th, 2014, 11:04pm » |
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on Nov 9th, 2014, 6:03pm, teao wrote:| the scientific method means first observation, then hypothesis, and then demonstration. But you cannot demonstrate your hypothesis. |
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? I don't know what you mean. All of technology is a demonstration of hypotheses/theories. Hypotheses predict consequences to test and work with. Because of science we can build computers, cars airplanes; these demonstrate that the predictions of quantum-mechanics, thermodynamics and aerodynamics (among many other theories) work out.
What hypotheses do you offer that has any practical consequence and value? That can prove their worth as more than myth?
Quote:You are all scientists within [ed]two hundred 450 [/ed] years. And our Bhagavata is written [ed]five 2.5 (or 1 if you mean the Bhagavata Purana)[/ed] thousand years ago. |
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And those 450 years got us cars, airplanes, computers, the internet, sanitation, etc.
What did 2500 years of Bhagavad-gita get you, other than a nice bed time story? You barely have sanitation now.
Quote:| Our Bhagavata is written five thousand years ago. |
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a) It wasn't. It's from the 5th century BC at best, possibly 2nd.
b) Even if it were, so what?
c) Homer's "Odyssey" predates it by several centuries, so if age=authority, then haha.
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| « Last Edit: Nov 9th, 2014, 11:26pm by towr » |
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teao
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #55 on: Nov 10th, 2014, 12:54am » |
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on Nov 9th, 2014, 11:04pm, towr wrote:
? I don't know what you mean. All of technology is a demonstration of hypotheses/theories. Hypotheses predict consequences to test and work with. Because of science we can build computers, cars airplanes; these demonstrate that the predictions of quantum-mechanics, thermodynamics and aerodynamics (among many other theories) work out.
*****skip*****haha. |
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The same example. Just like computer machine. you do not find that the machine is made by a brain which is different from this material. But you are trying to find out a brain from this. This is your childish thinking. The brain is different from machine. The machine is lump of iron. And the one who is working with the machine is a different from the machine. That you do not know. That you do not know. That is your defect. Now what is this computer machine will do unless there is a worker in the computer room, highly salaried man?
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rmsgrey
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #56 on: Nov 10th, 2014, 4:56am » |
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I say that we are made of the ashes of dead stars, and you call it dry nonsense. I say that we can tell what happened a hundred million generations ago, and you boast of stories less than a hundred generations old. I point at the wonder that my stories led to the creation of and allows us to send messages around the world at the speed of thought, and you say it's just a machine.
Consider a grain of sand. My stories would tell you of time spent as molten rock deep beneath the ground, the eruption of a volcano, the long, slow weathering of the volcanic rock, the boulder breaking down into gravel, smoothed into pebbles and worn away yet further by the action of stream, river and ocean. Maybe the grain is older, and, after becoming sand the first time, settled to an ancient sea-bed, and got pressed into sandstone, then in the slow-motion cataclysmic upheaval of a collision between continents, the layered sediments were raised into the air, where the wind and the rain patiently wore them down until our grain of sand was exposed once more, broke off the mass as part of a chunk of rock, and went through the process of eroding down to a single grain once more. Or I could talk about the chemistry of it - the rigid structure of atoms that gives it its strength. Or the uses for the silicon that's a large portion of sand, or the transformation of sand into glass, or...
What can you find in a grain of sand?
I live in a world full of wonders, and one of the greatest wonders of them all is that we can understand so much of it - that we can write down symbols and equations, and think about them, and then go out and say "let there be houses" or "let there be electric light" or "let there be a way of walking across water" or "let there be a device that, by adding 1s and 0s together, can show me images of what was happening on the far side of the world less than a second age, can let me talk to someone across continents and oceans, can create the illusion of entire worlds that I and others can then interact with, alone or together" and have those things come to pass.
So go on, tell me I'm a fool in a fool's paradise. I'll take my paradise over your blind authorities and dusty precepts.
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towr
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #57 on: Nov 10th, 2014, 9:08am » |
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on Nov 10th, 2014, 12:54am, teao wrote:| The same example. Just like computer machine. you do not find that the machine is made by a brain which is different from this material. But you are trying to find out a brain from this. |
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I don't understand what you're trying to say here. Could you rephrase it?
Quote:| The brain is different from machine. |
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On what basis do you make that claim?
It is a physical thing. Its function lies in its physical state, that's how we can now (up to a point) read minds using (f)MRI (yes, technology has progressed that far). There is no reason to think there is anything beyond the physical to the mind. But as always, we're open to evidence to the contrary.
Quote:| The machine is lump of iron. |
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It's not, actually. That's the problem when you have no interest in how things really are, you won't know what you're talking about. Computers currently work using semiconductors, silicon. Iron does not have the required quantum-mechanical properties.
There are other kinds of computers, you could make a purely mechanical one, like Babbage's difference engine; or one that uses DNA. But the current information age runs on silicon.
Quote:| Now what is this computer machine will do unless there is a worker in the computer room |
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I'd hazard to guess most computers in the world are operated from outside of the room, even building, they stand in.
And even if no human interfered with them, they'd just keep running their software until the power cuts out or they break. That's why we use computers, to automate things, so we don't have to constantly pay attention to it.
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teao
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #58 on: Nov 10th, 2014, 6:50pm » |
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on Nov 10th, 2014, 9:08am, towr wrote:
I don't understand *****skip****** attention to it. |
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The same thing: the computer machine. The rascal will think that a computer machine is working. No. The man is working. He pushes the button, then it works. Otherwise, what is the value of this machine? You keep the machine for thousands of years, it will not work. When another man will come, put the button, then it will work.
So who is working? The machine is working or the man is working?
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towr
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #59 on: Nov 11th, 2014, 9:11am » |
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on Nov 10th, 2014, 6:50pm, teao wrote:The same thing: the computer machine. The rascal will think that a computer machine is working. No. The man is working. He pushes the button, then it works. Otherwise, what is the value of this machine? You keep the machine for thousands of years, it will not work. When another man will come, put the button, then it will work.
So who is working? The machine is working or the man is working? |
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Like a human or other animal, once a computer is brought into the world and the software is running, then it can in principle operate itself as long as it has energy. No one needs to keep pushing buttons for it to keep working. I guess you've never heard of automation.
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rloginunix
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #60 on: Nov 11th, 2014, 9:56am » |
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on Nov 10th, 2014, 6:50pm, teao wrote:| The rascal will think that a computer machine is working. |
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There are many rascals on this planet. So what? Anyone has the right to be and remain a rascal all life long.
on Nov 10th, 2014, 6:50pm, teao wrote:| The rascal will think that a computer machine is working. No. The man is working. He pushes the button, then it works. Otherwise, what is the value of this machine? |
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Another pointless statement that can be applied to a variety of items. For example. Your kitchen knife. Who exactly cuts the loaf of bread with it? The man. The man is working. He moves the knife back and forth through the loaf of bread. Then the knife cuts. Otherwise, what is the value of this item (when it rests in the drawer)?
on Nov 10th, 2014, 6:50pm, teao wrote:| So who is working? The machine is working or the man is working? |
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Who cares? Using your own numbers - while you have been chanting "Hare Hare Krishna" for the last 5000 years some of us who have not, in just 200 years, created this "computer machine" (that you yourself by the way are using) that helps some of us operate submarines under the sea, fly the planes heavier than air through the air, move cars and trains on the land, launch satellites to orbit our and other planets.
Computers have helped us discover very large Mersenne Primes. A systematic use of computers have helped us find some Mersenne Primes that were lurking between the known Mersenne Primes and have been previously overlooked.
Computers combined with the technology based on fractals help us find cancer in its early stages - when it is treatable.
Computers connected into one large network allow us - humans of all walks of life, various ethnic, political, cultural and religious backgrounds and geographic locales - for the first time in human history exchange and share ideas freely and free of charge on the enormous scale never seen before. And I think that because of that we are on the verge of some new breathtaking scientific discovery.
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teao
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #61 on: Nov 12th, 2014, 1:11am » |
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on Nov 11th, 2014, 9:11am, towr wrote:
Like **skip** I guess you've never heard of automation. |
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so your computer is starting without any button ( automatically ) ?? and i have to believe such an [censored] like you ?
just see how big shameless and senseless [censored] you are.
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| « Last Edit: Dec 6th, 2014, 2:22pm by Grimbal » |
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rmsgrey
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #62 on: Nov 12th, 2014, 3:28am » |
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on Nov 12th, 2014, 1:11am, teao wrote:
so your computer is starting without any button ( automatically ) ?? and i have to believe such an rascal fool like you ?
just see how big shameless and senseless rascal you are. |
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So you speak English without having been taught? Or is it that you have needed input from other people too?
What difference does it make if a computer can't do something no human can either?
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towr
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #63 on: Nov 12th, 2014, 9:03am » |
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on Nov 12th, 2014, 1:11am, teao wrote:| so your computer is starting without any button ( automatically ) ?? |
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It can; it has features like wake-on-lan and wake-on-power.
So, did you give birth to yourself? Or did you need something else to get your process running? Are all your (probably very few) accomplishments your mother's, because she made you?
Quote:| and i have to believe such an rascal fool like you ? |
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You can believe whatever idiotic thing you want.
You don't have to believe me; you don't have to read what I write; you don't even have to acknowledge my existence. But regardless of what you do or do not believe, or do or do not do, the truth will not change. And without the rascally audacity to doubt received wisdom and the foolish tenacity to seek knowledge, you will never know even the smallest part of it.
Quote:| just see how big shameless and senseless rascal you are. |
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As a wise man once said, I don't think that means what you think it means.
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teao
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #64 on: Nov 12th, 2014, 5:15pm » |
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on Nov 12th, 2014, 9:03am, towr wrote:
It can; it has features like wake-on-lan and wake-on-power.
So, ****skip**** means.
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so [censored] you have to activate this wak-on-lan mod or it will work automatically without anyone's activation ? ( or without your will ) ?
unless you will activate this mod will it work ? ( you leave your computer for thousdands of years will this mod will work automatically ? )
no of course not unless some`1 else ( or you ) will activate this mod it will not work ( with your so called automatiocally.)
so what is meaning with talking with such an so called wise ( dullard ) like you ?
there is no meaning in wasting time with such an [censored] like you. ( and it is an fact )
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| « Last Edit: Dec 6th, 2014, 2:24pm by Grimbal » |
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towr
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Re: Here is the purpose of human life -
« Reply #65 on: Nov 13th, 2014, 10:20am » |
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*yawn*
Can't you come up with something interesting? We all get that you don't understand computer technology, or history, or science, or from the look of it anything much. You don't even understand the fine art of insults.
Are you trying to win an argument by boring us to death? It's a good thing you believe in reincarnation, because you would need several lifetimes to make any headway in an argument with the lackluster mental prowess you've got going. Heck, as far as conversation skills go, you could learn a things or two from Eliza, and she's a brainless automaton (said he as if it were a distinction).
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